Heathen v1.1

CeeJay · Post by **CeeJay** » Thu Jul 14, 2016 10:29 pm

A Heretic/Hexen inspired DOOM mod. All new weapons, enemies and items adding a more medieval/fantasy style to the game. Now for EDGE-Classic 1.34 or later.

VERSION 1.1
https://www.mediafire.com/file/vn1kqy08 ... 1.wad/file

ITEMS

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CREDITS

Spoiler:

Marscaleb · Post by **Marscaleb** » Fri Jul 15, 2016 2:32 am

I love a good fantasy setting. I've thought about pursuing that for a mod myself.
I recognize only some of the original sources for a lot of the art you are using. Maybe they would be more familiar to me if I had played more of Hexen.

I like what you have going on here. I really love the basic weapons; that starting staff and the basic bow. I kinda expect the bow to let the arrows fly further if I hold the fire button down longer. Also, the bow should be silent; it should not alert enemies. That's my take, at least.
That crossbow is neat, but the dynamic lights for it are WAY to strong. Try setting it to "quadratic" instead of "add."

There is that one weapon that fires a bouncing lava ball. I really like it, but at the same time kind of expect it to be more chaotic and damaging; when it started bouncing around I was worried I was about to kill myself from it. I suppose it would be better that it doesn't, but I honestly was a little disappointed that firing near a wall in a narrow hallway didn't get me fried.

All the other weapons seem adequate. I will thinka bout possible ways to improve them tomorrow.

CeeJay · Post by **CeeJay** » Fri Jul 15, 2016 5:07 am

The bow is still work-in-progress, I am not at all pleased with the current state of the projectile. I've no idea how I would go about making the arrows go further the longer the fire button is held down, don't know if this is possible.

The Hellroot will probably go as it feels out of place to me.

I came up with a basic concept for a BFG replacement today: Hand of God, brings lightning bolts down on all enemies within the field of view, using BFG splash-damage logic.

Post by **Corbachu** » Fri Jul 15, 2016 9:56 am

CeeJay - do you have any rendering errors playing this with [2.1.0-Test1]? I noticed you use the grAb chunk for the wand weapon, which is why I was curious. I made some minor changes to that code for Test2 but it might not have been a desirable one.

CeeJay · Post by **CeeJay** » Fri Jul 15, 2016 10:04 am

Yeah, it came with the lump I imported. I just exported the source PNG and dumped it into the WAD as it is.

Worth mentioning that I'm still using the previous final versions, not the test(s).

CeeJay · Post by **CeeJay** » Fri Jul 15, 2016 10:10 am

New build uploaded!

I think I got a nice BFG replacement

The projectile could be better though.

Marscaleb · Post by **Marscaleb** » Fri Jul 15, 2016 1:35 pm

I love that BFG replacement so very, very much!

I think what that rocket launcher replacement needs is for its main attack to be faster. It's supposed to be devastating, is it not? It's surprisingly hard to clear out a room with that thing because it takes to long to move through the room.

The purple hellstaff seems a bit under-powered. Especially for how it fires two energy blasts at once, I would just expect that thing to deal more damage than it does.

The chaingun replacement seems too inaccurate. For how quickly it goes through ammo and how many shots it takes to kill someone, too many of those shots are missing the target, plain and simple. The starting staff is still using the same ammo, and it can kill far more enemies for the same ammo cost.

And the melee weapon doesn't feel powerful enough. I'm slicing people with a scimitar, I expect them to go down pretty quickly. Instead they die about as fast as Doomguy punching them.

And there is no requirement that each new weapon has to replace an existing one. You can load up on tons of new weapons. So if one isn't working out right, you could still keep it around in your game. Likewise there is no requirement that each weapon has to fulfill the same basic role as one from Doom. That chaingun replacement doesn't need to actually be something rapid-fire.

But all that said, I really like that starting staff. It feel powerful, fun, and yet also inaccurate. The inaccuracy helps with it being a starting weapon. Altogether it isn't useless, but I do have an incentive to replace it.

The bow feels really fun for being sneaky and stealthy. I am having a lot of fun trying to make tricky shots connect. It feels a bit more powerful than a simple bow should be, but I guess that is going to depend on how well the other mechanics work out in the rest of the mod. The way I'm using it (being sneaky and making each shot carefully) I would expect it to kill most enemies in one shot, so it is not actually bad, but I expect some folks would just spam the thing and it might turn OP at that point.
It would require more modding than I think might be possible within the existing architecture, but it is a weapon I want to be able to score headshots with. I feel like taking my time with the bow and making my shots count should be really worth it. Be quick and just hit someone with a couple arrows to take them down, or be careful and make it connect to the head to get them in one shot. That would be so satisfying. Especially if it could increase in range/speed/(power?) if you hold it down for a moment.
As has been stated, might not be something that can actually be done here, but I am just stating this is how it feels to me like it should work.

And then that BFG replacement. As I said, so much fun. I assume the fact that it doesn't consume ammo is just a temporary thing. But I seem too miss too many of the shots as it is, and I want to hold it down and just pump it repeatedly to clear a busy room. Conceptually, it might work best if it only consumes ammo for each enemy hit by it, but that might something that can't be pulled off. You might consider having it use its own ammo independent of other weapons, turn down the damage it does, and have its use be centered around constantly pumping it; holding down the button and striking foes several times until they die. It might make for an interesting way to balance weapon economy.
Or just leave it as it is, plus ammo consumption. There's nothing wrong with a nice deadly OP weapon.

Oh, and those golems that replace the pinkies, they make way too much noise. I hear this constant TROMP TROMP TROMP TROMP when they are active; it's way too loud and annoying.

CeeJay · Post by **CeeJay** » Fri Jul 15, 2016 8:29 pm

Marscaleb wrote:I love that BFG replacement so very, very much!

I'm also very pleased with how it turned out, needs a little tweaking in places but other than that it turned out really nice. I really recommend Heretic and Hexen for an idea of the lore, D'sparil is an important character in Heretic.

Marscaleb wrote:I think what that rocket launcher replacement needs is for its main attack to be faster. It's supposed to be devastating, is it not? It's surprisingly hard to clear out a room with that thing because it takes to long to move through the room.

Making it faster would just make it OP i think. Might speed it up a little.

Marscaleb wrote:The purple hellstaff seems a bit under-powered. Especially for how it fires two energy blasts at once, I would just expect that thing to deal more damage than it does.

I'll get on that. Keep in mind all weapons will have secondary attacks. I have an idea for a wicked sec attack for the skullstaff. If you played Heretic you could probably guess what it is.

Marscaleb wrote:The chaingun replacement seems too inaccurate. For how quickly it goes through ammo and how many shots it takes to kill someone, too many of those shots are missing the target, plain and simple. The starting staff is still using the same ammo, and it can kill far more enemies for the same ammo cost.

Noted.

Marscaleb wrote:And the melee weapon doesn't feel powerful enough. I'm slicing people with a scimitar, I expect them to go down pretty quickly. Instead they die about as fast as Doomguy punching them.

with scimitar I assume you are referring to the sickle. I was thinking about scrapping the melee weapon all together and have the Wand of Embers be the default non-ammo weapon.

Marscaleb wrote:And there is no requirement that each new weapon has to replace an existing one. You can load up on tons of new weapons. So if one isn't working out right, you could still keep it around in your game. Likewise there is no requirement that each weapon has to fulfill the same basic role as one from Doom. That chaingun replacement doesn't need to actually be something rapid-fire.

No, but I would like to stick a basic scheme for balance sake, this has to work in vanilla levels after all.

Marscaleb wrote:But all that said, I really like that starting staff. It feel powerful, fun, and yet also inaccurate. The inaccuracy helps with it being a starting weapon. Altogether it isn't useless, but I do have an incentive to replace it.

Which is why I was thinking of relocating it to slot 0 and make it the default non-ammo weapon.

Marscaleb wrote:It would require more modding than I think might be possible within the existing architecture, but it is a weapon I want to be able to score headshots with. I feel like taking my time with the bow and making my shots count should be really worth it. Be quick and just hit someone with a couple arrows to take them down, or be careful and make it connect to the head to get them in one shot. That would be so satisfying. Especially if it could increase in range/speed/(power?) if you hold it down for a moment.

As has been stated, might not be something that can actually be done here, but I am just stating this is how it feels to me like it should work.

Headshots (Weakness) is a feature in EDGE/3DGE and it's very easy to do.

Marscaleb wrote:And then that BFG replacement. As I said, so much fun. I assume the fact that it doesn't consume ammo is just a temporary thing. But I seem too miss too many of the shots as it is, and I want to hold it down and just pump it repeatedly to clear a busy room. Conceptually, it might work best if it only consumes ammo for each enemy hit by it, but that might something that can't be pulled off. You might consider having it use its own ammo independent of other weapons, turn down the damage it does, and have its use be centered around constantly pumping it; holding down the button and striking foes several times until they die. It might make for an interesting way to balance weapon economy.
Or just leave it as it is, plus ammo consumption. There's nothing wrong with a nice deadly OP weapon.

Ammo is unlimited for testing purposes. same reason why the Fallen (Mastermind replacement) only has 1HP.

Marscaleb wrote:Oh, and those golems that replace the pinkies, they make way too much noise. I hear this constant TROMP TROMP TROMP TROMP when they are active; it's way too loud and annoying.

Yeah, I need to lower the volume or replace the sfx completely.

RUNSABER · Post by **RUNSABER** » Sun Jul 17, 2016 3:20 pm

I'll get this a run when I get back - I'm working on s particle system that may go well with this

also, I have some sprites you may find helpful in your weapons. Will be posting samples soon

CeeJay · Post by **CeeJay** » Sun Jul 17, 2016 8:56 pm

Sounds awesome.

Haven't done much work in a couple of days but I'll get working on the secondary attacks in the week. Still wish to replace the Hellroot, I like the basic concept but It just feels too out of place. Maybe it's just me.

Could do with help, of any kind, with the HUD. Resources, design, etc.

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Heathen v1.1

Heathen v1.1

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